Android device speed

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Android device speed

** Clarence P Martin ** via use-livecode
Hello everyone,

I just put my app on a galaxy tab E as a test.

It is painfully slow, but not just in the LC portion of the app. The map, delivered through a browser widget, is also slow.

So, I used the regular browser (chrome) at the webglearth website. That was slow too, although not as bad. I think the main difference was that the map div at their website is small, so it takes less processing power.

I had thought I selected a midlevel Android device that can handle moderate amounts of computation.

In y'alls' experience, are android devices just slow? Do they have inferior graphics processors? If you make computationally heavy apps for Android, do you just warn users that the app will only work on some devices?

I want this to work on as many devices as possible, but 3D maps require lots of processing.

Thanks,

J

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: Android device speed

** Clarence P Martin ** via use-livecode
Android devices come with a variety of different specifications. The high
end models will be more capable than low end ones. Depending on
manufacturer and model, the graphics card will vary in capability and
available RAM. Screen resolution also makes a difference. I'm using older
test devices because I figure if it works there it will work on most
others. But my Samsung S4 runs more slowly than my S5 and they were
released only a year apart. And my Nexus tablet, which is older than both
Samsung phones, runs as well or better than either of those, probably
because it has a lower screen resolution. I'm not sure there's a standard
you can rely on.

I guess in general you could say that Android runs slower, but it's
probably because there are so many low cost phones with subsequently less
processing power. When you get into the higher range phones they can be
quite acceptable. The same app that lagged on my Samsung ran fine on
someone else's Pixel.

--
Jacqueline Landman Gay         |     [hidden email]
HyperActive Software           |     http://www.hyperactivesw.com



On August 2, 2017 6:14:06 PM Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hello everyone,
>
> I just put my app on a galaxy tab E as a test.
>
> It is painfully slow, but not just in the LC portion of the app. The map,
> delivered through a browser widget, is also slow.
>
> So, I used the regular browser (chrome) at the webglearth website. That was
> slow too, although not as bad. I think the main difference was that the map
> div at their website is small, so it takes less processing power.
>
> I had thought I selected a midlevel Android device that can handle moderate
> amounts of computation.
>
> In y'alls' experience, are android devices just slow? Do they have inferior
> graphics processors? If you make computationally heavy apps for Android, do
> you just warn users that the app will only work on some devices?
>
> I want this to work on as many devices as possible, but 3D maps require
> lots of processing.
>
> Thanks,
>
> J
>
> Sent from my iPhone
> _______________________________________________
> use-livecode mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
> subscription preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode



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Re: Android device speed

** Clarence P Martin ** via use-livecode
Thank you, Jacqueline,


It sounds like I need to find a way to detect the processing speed of the device.

If it is below a certain level, it could adjust the div viewport for the map proportionally to the processing power.

It could reduce the size of the div, then reexpand it, using a 2d transform. By cutting the size of the div in half, vertically and horizontally, it would have a quarter of the number of pixels to process in 3D. Reexpanding would return it to the original number of pixels, but that is a 2d transform and would be much less of a burden on the processor.

The effect would be lower resolution and zoomed in, but that might be better than painfully slow map movements.

Do you have any suggestions on how to detect the device's graphics processing power?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 3, 2017, at 3:20 AM, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Android devices come with a variety of different specifications. The high end models will be more capable than low end ones. Depending on manufacturer and model, the graphics card will vary in capability and available RAM. Screen resolution also makes a difference. I'm using older test devices because I figure if it works there it will work on most others. But my Samsung S4 runs more slowly than my S5 and they were released only a year apart. And my Nexus tablet, which is older than both Samsung phones, runs as well or better than either of those, probably because it has a lower screen resolution. I'm not sure there's a standard you can rely on.
>
> I guess in general you could say that Android runs slower, but it's probably because there are so many low cost phones with subsequently less processing power. When you get into the higher range phones they can be quite acceptable. The same app that lagged on my Samsung ran fine on someone else's Pixel.
>
> --
> Jacqueline Landman Gay         |     [hidden email]
> HyperActive Software           |     http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>
>
>
>> On August 2, 2017 6:14:06 PM Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Hello everyone,
>>
>> I just put my app on a galaxy tab E as a test.
>>
>> It is painfully slow, but not just in the LC portion of the app. The map, delivered through a browser widget, is also slow.
>>
>> So, I used the regular browser (chrome) at the webglearth website. That was slow too, although not as bad. I think the main difference was that the map div at their website is small, so it takes less processing power.
>>
>> I had thought I selected a midlevel Android device that can handle moderate amounts of computation.
>>
>> In y'alls' experience, are android devices just slow? Do they have inferior graphics processors? If you make computationally heavy apps for Android, do you just warn users that the app will only work on some devices?
>>
>> I want this to work on as many devices as possible, but 3D maps require lots of processing.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> J
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> _______________________________________________
>> use-livecode mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences:
>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-livecode mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

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Re: Android device speed

** Clarence P Martin ** via use-livecode
In reply to this post by ** Clarence P Martin ** via use-livecode
> Jonathan wrote:
> It sounds like I need to find a way to detect the processing speed
> of the device.

Did you alread try to use webgl? See the source of
https://browserleaks.com/webgl

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Re: Android device speed

** Clarence P Martin ** via use-livecode
Hi Hermann,

That page is a great resource!

Some of their measurements might be a good proxy for GPU power, like the max viewport size and a couple others.

It would be preferable to fully internalize the system check. I will look through the page source to see what JS commands they use to measure system capabilities.

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 3, 2017, at 7:27 AM, hh via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:

>> Jonathan wrote:
>> It sounds like I need to find a way to detect the processing speed
>> of the device.
>
> Did you alread try to use webgl? See the source of
> https://browserleaks.com/webgl
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-livecode mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

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Re: Android device speed

** Clarence P Martin ** via use-livecode
In reply to this post by ** Clarence P Martin ** via use-livecode
I would be more inclined to not say in general "...that Android runs
slower...", but rather "Android runs LiveCode apps slower."

There are plenty of Android apps in the Play store that handle large
graphics VERY well on Android.  It may or may not be just how LiveCode
rolls, as an improved experience can be achieved by handling images better
in your code. Breaking them up into grid pieces, and only displaying the
portion that is within the current view is one way.  You can also reduce
the size of PNG files using specialized utilities like TinyPNG.

~Roger

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 3:20 AM, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> Android devices come with a variety of different specifications. The high
> end models will be more capable than low end ones. Depending on
> manufacturer and model, the graphics card will vary in capability and
> available RAM. Screen resolution also makes a difference. I'm using older
> test devices because I figure if it works there it will work on most
> others. But my Samsung S4 runs more slowly than my S5 and they were
> released only a year apart. And my Nexus tablet, which is older than both
> Samsung phones, runs as well or better than either of those, probably
> because it has a lower screen resolution. I'm not sure there's a standard
> you can rely on.
>
> I guess in general you could say that Android runs slower, but it's
> probably because there are so many low cost phones with subsequently less
> processing power. When you get into the higher range phones they can be
> quite acceptable. The same app that lagged on my Samsung ran fine on
> someone else's Pixel.
>
> --
> Jacqueline Landman Gay         |     [hidden email]
> HyperActive Software           |     http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>
>
>
>
> On August 2, 2017 6:14:06 PM Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hello everyone,
>>
>> I just put my app on a galaxy tab E as a test.
>>
>> It is painfully slow, but not just in the LC portion of the app. The map,
>> delivered through a browser widget, is also slow.
>>
>> So, I used the regular browser (chrome) at the webglearth website. That
>> was slow too, although not as bad. I think the main difference was that the
>> map div at their website is small, so it takes less processing power.
>>
>> I had thought I selected a midlevel Android device that can handle
>> moderate amounts of computation.
>>
>> In y'alls' experience, are android devices just slow? Do they have
>> inferior graphics processors? If you make computationally heavy apps for
>> Android, do you just warn users that the app will only work on some devices?
>>
>> I want this to work on as many devices as possible, but 3D maps require
>> lots of processing.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> J
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> _______________________________________________
>> use-livecode mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
>> subscription preferences:
>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-livecode mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
> subscription preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>
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Re: Android device speed

** Clarence P Martin ** via use-livecode
Thanks Roger,

In this case, the issue is more with the map presented in a browser widget, which is less about LC and more about the embedded chrome framework.

I think that my device is not really a high-end android machine, either.

It looks like max-texture-size might be a decent proxy for measuring GPU power.


Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 3, 2017, at 8:36 AM, Roger Eller via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I would be more inclined to not say in general "...that Android runs
> slower...", but rather "Android runs LiveCode apps slower."
>
> There are plenty of Android apps in the Play store that handle large
> graphics VERY well on Android.  It may or may not be just how LiveCode
> rolls, as an improved experience can be achieved by handling images better
> in your code. Breaking them up into grid pieces, and only displaying the
> portion that is within the current view is one way.  You can also reduce
> the size of PNG files using specialized utilities like TinyPNG.
>
> ~Roger
>
> On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 3:20 AM, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Android devices come with a variety of different specifications. The high
>> end models will be more capable than low end ones. Depending on
>> manufacturer and model, the graphics card will vary in capability and
>> available RAM. Screen resolution also makes a difference. I'm using older
>> test devices because I figure if it works there it will work on most
>> others. But my Samsung S4 runs more slowly than my S5 and they were
>> released only a year apart. And my Nexus tablet, which is older than both
>> Samsung phones, runs as well or better than either of those, probably
>> because it has a lower screen resolution. I'm not sure there's a standard
>> you can rely on.
>>
>> I guess in general you could say that Android runs slower, but it's
>> probably because there are so many low cost phones with subsequently less
>> processing power. When you get into the higher range phones they can be
>> quite acceptable. The same app that lagged on my Samsung ran fine on
>> someone else's Pixel.
>>
>> --
>> Jacqueline Landman Gay         |     [hidden email]
>> HyperActive Software           |     http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On August 2, 2017 6:14:06 PM Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode <
>> [hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Hello everyone,
>>>
>>> I just put my app on a galaxy tab E as a test.
>>>
>>> It is painfully slow, but not just in the LC portion of the app. The map,
>>> delivered through a browser widget, is also slow.
>>>
>>> So, I used the regular browser (chrome) at the webglearth website. That
>>> was slow too, although not as bad. I think the main difference was that the
>>> map div at their website is small, so it takes less processing power.
>>>
>>> I had thought I selected a midlevel Android device that can handle
>>> moderate amounts of computation.
>>>
>>> In y'alls' experience, are android devices just slow? Do they have
>>> inferior graphics processors? If you make computationally heavy apps for
>>> Android, do you just warn users that the app will only work on some devices?
>>>
>>> I want this to work on as many devices as possible, but 3D maps require
>>> lots of processing.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> J
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> use-livecode mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
>>> subscription preferences:
>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> use-livecode mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
>> subscription preferences:
>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>
> _______________________________________________
> use-livecode mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

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Re: Android device speed

** Clarence P Martin ** via use-livecode
It looks like we need to use a combination of requestAnimationFrame and performance.now in JavaScript to test the GPU.

I would rather test the GPU in LC, but I don't know how to do that without having a visible animation on the screen.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 3, 2017, at 9:05 AM, [hidden email] wrote:
>
> Thanks Roger,
>
> In this case, the issue is more with the map presented in a browser widget, which is less about LC and more about the embedded chrome framework.
>
> I think that my device is not really a high-end android machine, either.
>
> It looks like max-texture-size might be a decent proxy for measuring GPU power.
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Aug 3, 2017, at 8:36 AM, Roger Eller via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> I would be more inclined to not say in general "...that Android runs
>> slower...", but rather "Android runs LiveCode apps slower."
>>
>> There are plenty of Android apps in the Play store that handle large
>> graphics VERY well on Android.  It may or may not be just how LiveCode
>> rolls, as an improved experience can be achieved by handling images better
>> in your code. Breaking them up into grid pieces, and only displaying the
>> portion that is within the current view is one way.  You can also reduce
>> the size of PNG files using specialized utilities like TinyPNG.
>>
>> ~Roger
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 3:20 AM, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode <
>> [hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> Android devices come with a variety of different specifications. The high
>>> end models will be more capable than low end ones. Depending on
>>> manufacturer and model, the graphics card will vary in capability and
>>> available RAM. Screen resolution also makes a difference. I'm using older
>>> test devices because I figure if it works there it will work on most
>>> others. But my Samsung S4 runs more slowly than my S5 and they were
>>> released only a year apart. And my Nexus tablet, which is older than both
>>> Samsung phones, runs as well or better than either of those, probably
>>> because it has a lower screen resolution. I'm not sure there's a standard
>>> you can rely on.
>>>
>>> I guess in general you could say that Android runs slower, but it's
>>> probably because there are so many low cost phones with subsequently less
>>> processing power. When you get into the higher range phones they can be
>>> quite acceptable. The same app that lagged on my Samsung ran fine on
>>> someone else's Pixel.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Jacqueline Landman Gay         |     [hidden email]
>>> HyperActive Software           |     http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On August 2, 2017 6:14:06 PM Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode <
>>> [hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello everyone,
>>>>
>>>> I just put my app on a galaxy tab E as a test.
>>>>
>>>> It is painfully slow, but not just in the LC portion of the app. The map,
>>>> delivered through a browser widget, is also slow.
>>>>
>>>> So, I used the regular browser (chrome) at the webglearth website. That
>>>> was slow too, although not as bad. I think the main difference was that the
>>>> map div at their website is small, so it takes less processing power.
>>>>
>>>> I had thought I selected a midlevel Android device that can handle
>>>> moderate amounts of computation.
>>>>
>>>> In y'alls' experience, are android devices just slow? Do they have
>>>> inferior graphics processors? If you make computationally heavy apps for
>>>> Android, do you just warn users that the app will only work on some devices?
>>>>
>>>> I want this to work on as many devices as possible, but 3D maps require
>>>> lots of processing.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> J
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> use-livecode mailing list
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
>>>> subscription preferences:
>>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> use-livecode mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
>>> subscription preferences:
>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> use-livecode mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences:
>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

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Re: Android device speed

** Clarence P Martin ** via use-livecode
I am overthinking this.

A group that is visible but layered under another object would do it.

1. Turn on accelerated rendering
2. Scroll the group programmatically from top to bottom as many times as possible in a quarter second.
3. Adjust the div size based on the number of times it can do the scroll.

I would just need to experiment to determine how the repeat rate relates  to app performance.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 3, 2017, at 5:07 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>
> It looks like we need to use a combination of requestAnimationFrame and performance.now in JavaScript to test the GPU.
>
> I would rather test the GPU in LC, but I don't know how to do that without having a visible animation on the screen.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Aug 3, 2017, at 9:05 AM, [hidden email] wrote:
>>
>> Thanks Roger,
>>
>> In this case, the issue is more with the map presented in a browser widget, which is less about LC and more about the embedded chrome framework.
>>
>> I think that my device is not really a high-end android machine, either.
>>
>> It looks like max-texture-size might be a decent proxy for measuring GPU power.
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Aug 3, 2017, at 8:36 AM, Roger Eller via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> I would be more inclined to not say in general "...that Android runs
>>> slower...", but rather "Android runs LiveCode apps slower."
>>>
>>> There are plenty of Android apps in the Play store that handle large
>>> graphics VERY well on Android.  It may or may not be just how LiveCode
>>> rolls, as an improved experience can be achieved by handling images better
>>> in your code. Breaking them up into grid pieces, and only displaying the
>>> portion that is within the current view is one way.  You can also reduce
>>> the size of PNG files using specialized utilities like TinyPNG.
>>>
>>> ~Roger
>>>
>>> On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 3:20 AM, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode <
>>> [hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Android devices come with a variety of different specifications. The high
>>>> end models will be more capable than low end ones. Depending on
>>>> manufacturer and model, the graphics card will vary in capability and
>>>> available RAM. Screen resolution also makes a difference. I'm using older
>>>> test devices because I figure if it works there it will work on most
>>>> others. But my Samsung S4 runs more slowly than my S5 and they were
>>>> released only a year apart. And my Nexus tablet, which is older than both
>>>> Samsung phones, runs as well or better than either of those, probably
>>>> because it has a lower screen resolution. I'm not sure there's a standard
>>>> you can rely on.
>>>>
>>>> I guess in general you could say that Android runs slower, but it's
>>>> probably because there are so many low cost phones with subsequently less
>>>> processing power. When you get into the higher range phones they can be
>>>> quite acceptable. The same app that lagged on my Samsung ran fine on
>>>> someone else's Pixel.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Jacqueline Landman Gay         |     [hidden email]
>>>> HyperActive Software           |     http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On August 2, 2017 6:14:06 PM Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode <
>>>> [hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hello everyone,
>>>>>
>>>>> I just put my app on a galaxy tab E as a test.
>>>>>
>>>>> It is painfully slow, but not just in the LC portion of the app. The map,
>>>>> delivered through a browser widget, is also slow.
>>>>>
>>>>> So, I used the regular browser (chrome) at the webglearth website. That
>>>>> was slow too, although not as bad. I think the main difference was that the
>>>>> map div at their website is small, so it takes less processing power.
>>>>>
>>>>> I had thought I selected a midlevel Android device that can handle
>>>>> moderate amounts of computation.
>>>>>
>>>>> In y'alls' experience, are android devices just slow? Do they have
>>>>> inferior graphics processors? If you make computationally heavy apps for
>>>>> Android, do you just warn users that the app will only work on some devices?
>>>>>
>>>>> I want this to work on as many devices as possible, but 3D maps require
>>>>> lots of processing.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> J
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> use-livecode mailing list
>>>>> [hidden email]
>>>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
>>>>> subscription preferences:
>>>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> use-livecode mailing list
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
>>>> subscription preferences:
>>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> use-livecode mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences:
>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

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