Does exists LiveCode Server Portable...

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Does exists LiveCode Server Portable...

Alejandro Tejada
Hi All,

LiveCode could open a socket to send and receive
data from other applications.

Does exists a method to create a portable
LiveCode server that runs locally without
installing any file in the computer?

In one of my computers, every application
that opens a socket must be authorized
by the user because Zone Alarm ask for
permission...

Notice that I run many versions of
LiveCode and none of them are installed.
I launch LiveCode from their own
folder. All versions of LiveCode are within
the Documents folder, not installed inside
the Windows Program folder.

Al
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Re: Does exists LiveCode Server Portable...

Björnke von Gierke
I'm not sure I understand your question correctly, so here's two answers:

Any livecode standalone can be a server. All you need to do is to use the "accept socket" command. For example, the ChatRev server runs from an IDE installed on an old ibook. But it could as well be a windows standalone (which it was some years back).

If you however mean the livecode server thing that runs in a web server, then you probably can't run it as server without apache or iss. however, you can run livecode locally as a non-server engine where it will behave exactly like a server, outputting text to the shell instead of a http connection.

Maybe you can specify a bit more detailed what the goal is, and why you want to work around zone alarm?

On 13 May 2014, at 01:44, Alejandro Tejada <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> LiveCode could open a socket to send and receive
> data from other applications.
>
> Does exists a method to create a portable
> LiveCode server that runs locally without
> installing any file in the computer?
>
> In one of my computers, every application
> that opens a socket must be authorized
> by the user because Zone Alarm ask for
> permission...
>
> Notice that I run many versions of
> LiveCode and none of them are installed.
> I launch LiveCode from their own
> folder. All versions of LiveCode are within
> the Documents folder, not installed inside
> the Windows Program folder.
>
> Al
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Does-exists-LiveCode-Server-Portable-tp4679431.html
> Sent from the Revolution - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-livecode mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode

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Re: Does exists LiveCode Server Portable...

Richard Gaskin
In reply to this post by Alejandro Tejada
Alejandro Tejada wrote:

> LiveCode could open a socket to send and receive
> data from other applications.
>
> Does exists a method to create a portable
> LiveCode server that runs locally without
> installing any file in the computer?

Many years ago Dr. Raney made a stack available at the old MetaCard site
called mchttpd which is exactly that:  a simple Web server built in what
was then called MetaCard.

It still runs in LiveCode, but needed modification to output proper
headers for more recent browsers, so with Dr. Raney's permission I've
modified it and you can download it here:
<http://fourthworld.net/lc/mchttpd-4W.zip>

I still prefer working with Apache for most things since it lets me
mirror the environment I'll be using when I move what I'm working on
locally to a public server, but for specialized services mchttpd can be
a good starting point.

> In one of my computers, every application
> that opens a socket must be authorized
> by the user because Zone Alarm ask for
> permission...

A similar requirement happens on OS X as well:  in Lion and later (I
don't recall seeing this in Snow Leopard), whenever an app starts
listening on a port the OS notifies the user and asks for confirmation.

This is very helpful, since most serious OSes (read OS X and Linux)
usually ship with all incoming traffic blocked (well, that's true for
Ubuntu, not sure about other distros or how well OS X matches that
security decision).  This means that out of the box the system is
unreachable from the outside, leaving it to the user to explicitly open
any ports they might need, while most users never need to go out of
their way to have the system reasonably well protected.

Once you open a port you're inviting traffic to your machine.  Of course
most folks have a router to negotiate between their internal network and
the external Internet, and most routers should require explicit action
to set up the forwarding of requests to a specific port from the outside
world to the machine providing the service.  So without that, on most
routers worth using, things like mchttpd are useful for intranet
services yet still unreachable to the outside world.

As written, mchttpd is pretty nice, and fairly limited - by design, so
that it won't, for example, run "do" on arbitrary strings passed into it.

But it's extensible, so if one were inclined to live dangerously you
could extend mchttpd to allow it to "do" any LiveCode statements passed
in as arguments to the HTTP request - and then your machine could be
pwned by anyone who can reach it.

Set up port forwarding on your router to allow the world to do that, and
it would be an interesting measure of LiveCode's current global adoption
to find out how long it would be until your machine gets pwned. ;)

Of course in any real system you'd want to be very careful to avoid such
injection exploits.

One of the reasons I've tried to get "do", "eval" and the rest out of my
habits is not merely because there are almost almost always better
alternatives, but that if I ever get absent-minded I'm less likely by
habit to include anything like that in server code.

Interesting exercise for the reader:

On a Mac, open Console and in the side pane click on appfirewall.log

- or -

In Lubuntu, run:

   more /var/log/auth.log

The world is full of botnets randomly attempting access on all ports on
all machines all day long....

On my critical machines I recently set up shared keys between the
various computers I use, and once that was done I modded my
/etc/sshd_config so that it no longer allows password login at all.

The downside is that whenever I get a new computer I have to add its key
by going through one of the existing ones already known in authorized_keys.

But the upside is that no one can use any password to get in, since all
passwords are rejected.

--
  Richard Gaskin
  Fourth World
  LiveCode training and consulting: http://www.fourthworld.com
  Webzine for LiveCode developers: http://www.LiveCodeJournal.com
  Follow me on Twitter:  http://twitter.com/FourthWorldSys

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Re: Does exists LiveCode Server Portable...

Alejandro Tejada
Network Security must be one of the fastest
moving areas in computer technology... :o

Looks like the knowledge in this area is replaced
and discarded every few days or hours
(probably faster than in any other
area in Computer Science).

This explains why an experienced IT security
manager commands a salary in the range
$145,000 - $177,000.

http://www.networkworld.com/news/2014/051214-windows-xp-die-hards-can-slash-281505.html?t51hb

By the way, I do not want to bypass
the Zone Alarm warning about a program
who wants to reach the internet.

A Portable LiveCode Server would help a lot
towards the adoption of it.

Al  
 
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Re: Does exists LiveCode Server Portable...

Alejandro Tejada
This is the correct link, instead of XP die-hards... :D
http://www.networkworld.com/news/2013/061213-highest-lowest-tech-salaries-271126.html

Al
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Re: Does exists LiveCode Server Portable...

Richard Gaskin
In reply to this post by Alejandro Tejada
Alejandro Tejada wrote:
> A Portable LiveCode Server would help a lot
> towards the adoption of it.

What do you mean by "portable"?

Servers run many services, LiveCode being just one.  They also need DNS.
  So using LC Server under Apache at a Web host seems a good way to go, no?

Besides, neither mchttpd nor any other standalone will do quite what LC
Server does in terms of mixing HTML with executable LiveCode.   The
merge function available to standalones is quite different from the one
called implicitly in Server (no control structures, for example).

mchttd can be a good solution for providing specialized services, but
for integration with publicly accessible servers LC Server is the way to go.

--
  Richard Gaskin
  Fourth World
  LiveCode training and consulting: http://www.fourthworld.com
  Webzine for LiveCode developers: http://www.LiveCodeJournal.com
  Follow me on Twitter:  http://twitter.com/FourthWorldSys

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Re: Does exists LiveCode Server Portable...

Alejandro Tejada
In reply to this post by Richard Gaskin
Hi Richard,

Richard Gaskin wrote
Many years ago Dr. Raney made a stack available at the old MetaCard site
called mchttpd which is exactly that:  a simple Web server built in what
was then called MetaCard.

It still runs in LiveCode, but needed modification to output proper
headers for more recent browsers, so with Dr. Raney's permission I've
modified it and you can download it here:
<http://fourthworld.net/lc/mchttpd-4W.zip>

[snip]
Excellent! :D

After clicking the button "START SERVER"
Zone Alarm alerted me that LiveCode
wants to open port 8080.

After authorizing this connection,
I pasted this in Google Chrome
new tab:

http://localhost:8080

and there it is.
 
A welcome webpage served by
mchttpd itself! :D
Just all images links are broken.

This page:
http://localhost:8080/answerClient
works really fine and now it's my
turn to experiment, change and
extend this basic example.

I just keep wondering:
Does exists a method to use Ralf Bitter's revIgniter
with this server?  http://revigniter.com/

By the way, inside the folder cgi-bin
there is a file named: link_MC_here-_
What does this means?

There is no explanation
in this page either:
http://localhost:8080/nextpage.html

The server script: echo.mt
http://localhost:8080/echo.mt
just produces a single character,
the number 1 after running.

Richard, many thanks again for updating and
reposting this stack from your archives!

Al


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Re: Does exists LiveCode Server Portable...

Alejandro Tejada
In reply to this post by Richard Gaskin
Richard Gaskin wrote
What do you mean by "portable"?
Servers run many services, LiveCode being just one.
They also need DNS. So using LC Server under Apache
at a Web host seems a good way to go, no?

Besides, neither mchttpd nor any other standalone
will do quite what LC Server does in terms of mixing
HTML with executable LiveCode. The merge function
available to standalones is quite different from the one
called implicitly in Server (no control structures, for example).

mchttd can be a good solution for providing specialized
services, but for integration with publicly accessible
servers LC Server is the way to go.
Then, mchttpd could work as new starting point
for this shelved project:

http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Looking-for-volunteers-to-create-Wikipedia-on-CD-application-td1288518.html

(Some days, I feel sad, really sad about the current state
of teacher's mental development in the place where I live...
but hope still remains. What I would do when it's gone?)  :-(

Al
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Re: Does exists LiveCode Server Portable...

Richard Gaskin
Alejandro Tejada wrote:

> Richard Gaskin wrote
>> What do you mean by "portable"?
...
> Then, mchttpd could work as new starting point
> for this shelved project:
>
> http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Looking-for-volunteers-to-create-Wikipedia-on-CD-application-td1288518.html

It would be nice to see LC in that, but there are many ways to solve
that problem.

One of the members of my local Linux User Group, Braddock Gaskill, has
been working on a very nice solution using a wifi hard drive to bring
the Internet into classrooms in areas where they have no Internet
infrastructure - Internet In A Box:

    The device includes Wikipedia in 37 languages, a library of 40,000
    e-books, most of the world's open source software and source code,
    hundreds of hours of instructional videos, and world-wide mapping
    down to street level.

    We can deploy a "knowledge hotspot" anywhere in the world - even
    under solar power.

<http://internet-in-a-box.org/>

Once the Linux ARM build of LiveCode is done, it can play a role on
hardware like that.  Most folks want that build for Raspberry Pi, but I
have my sights on using in on wifi drives and other small devices.

--
  Richard Gaskin
  Fourth World Systems
  Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
  ____________________________________________________________________
  [hidden email]                http://www.FourthWorld.com

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Re: Does exists LiveCode Server Portable...

Glen Bojsza
Is there a actual roadmap for "*Linux ARM build of LiveCode*"?

Glen

>
>
>  Richard Gaskin wrote
>>
>>>
>>>
> Once the Linux ARM build of LiveCode is done, it can play a role on
> hardware like that.  Most folks want that build for Raspberry Pi, but I
> have my sights on using in on wifi drives and other small devices.
>
> --
>  Richard Gaskin
>  Fourth World Systems
>  Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
>  ____________________________________________________________________
>  [hidden email]                http://www.FourthWorld.com
>
>
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Re: Does exists LiveCode Server Portable...

Richard Gaskin
Glen Bojsza wrote:
> Is there a actual roadmap for "*Linux ARM build of LiveCode*"?

There's no separate Road Map for it yet, and with the team committed to
the goals outlined in the Kickstarter campaign it's not their highest
priority.

But there is a section of the forums devoted to it, where updates are
posted from time to time along with community-contributed stacks of
interest to that segment:
<http://forums.runrev.com/viewforum.php?f=76>

The builds are available at the bottom of the Downloads page:
<http://downloads.livecode.com/livecode/>

I don't have a Raspberry Pi myself yet so I can't comment on how
complete the current build is.  But it seems usable enough for the folks
in the forum to be building with it, and anything remaining could be
done by any member of the community with an interest in helping it along.

--
  Richard Gaskin
  Fourth World
  LiveCode training and consulting: http://www.fourthworld.com
  Webzine for LiveCode developers: http://www.LiveCodeJournal.com
  Follow me on Twitter:  http://twitter.com/FourthWorldSys

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Re: Does exists LiveCode Server Portable...

Alejandro Tejada
In reply to this post by Richard Gaskin
Richard Gaskin wrote
One of the members of my local Linux User Group, Braddock Gaskill, has
been working on a very nice solution using a wifi hard drive to bring
the Internet into classrooms in areas where they have no Internet
infrastructure - Internet In A Box:

    The device includes Wikipedia in 37 languages, a library of 40,000
    e-books, most of the world's open source software and source code,
    hundreds of hours of instructional videos, and world-wide mapping
    down to street level.

    We can deploy a "knowledge hotspot" anywhere in the world - even
    under solar power.

<http://internet-in-a-box.org/>

Once the Linux ARM build of LiveCode is done, it can play a role on
hardware like that.  Most folks want that build for Raspberry Pi, but I
have my sights on using in on wifi drives and other small devices.
Wonderful project! Many Thanks for posting this link. :D

But the Wikipedia on CD/DVD aim to reach all those students
and Teachers without an Internet connection at home, that
(still today) costs almost US$60 dollars monthly...

Al