LC 8 Property Inspector

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LC 8 Property Inspector

Ali Lloyd-2
So that this does not get lost in the Project Browser / App Browser thread,
I've split it off into a separate topic:

On Wed, Oct 7, 2015 at 8:04 PM Richmond <[hidden email]> wrote:

> While I'm on a roll, I could also point out that I cannot see any
> obvious advantages in the complete
> remake of the Preference Palette in LiveCode 8.


There may not be many immediately obvious advantages to the new property
inspector, but there are two extraordinarily significant related ones:

1) Widget properties would not work with the old inspector. You would
perhaps have to create individual stacks for each widget and have its card
copied to the inspector. This is really not practical or viable in the long
term.

The new inspector just requires a few lines of metadata in the widget file
specifying what type of editor to use for a given property. Everything else
happens automatically.

2) The new inspector is *really* flexible for the classic objects. Have a
look at this fix for bug 16118 (no way to change a scrollbar's tooltip in
the property inspector):
https://github.com/livecode/livecode-ide/pull/562/files


We'd like to make it as good and useful as possible. If the worst you can
say is you can't see any advantages, then I think the non-obvious ones
above make it well worth it ;-) Otherwise it would be great to hear
constructive criticism and suggestions for improvement.

Ali
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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Richmond Mathewson-2
On 08/10/15 12:14, Ali Lloyd wrote:

> So that this does not get lost in the Project Browser / App Browser thread,
> I've split it off into a separate topic:
>
> On Wed, Oct 7, 2015 at 8:04 PM Richmond <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> While I'm on a roll, I could also point out that I cannot see any
>> obvious advantages in the complete
>> remake of the Preference Palette in LiveCode 8.
>
> There may not be many immediately obvious advantages to the new property
> inspector, but there are two extraordinarily significant related ones:
>
> 1) Widget properties would not work with the old inspector. You would
> perhaps have to create individual stacks for each widget and have its card
> copied to the inspector. This is really not practical or viable in the long
> term.
>
> The new inspector just requires a few lines of metadata in the widget file
> specifying what type of editor to use for a given property. Everything else
> happens automatically.
>
> 2) The new inspector is *really* flexible for the classic objects. Have a
> look at this fix for bug 16118 (no way to change a scrollbar's tooltip in
> the property inspector):
> https://github.com/livecode/livecode-ide/pull/562/files
>
>
> We'd like to make it as good and useful as possible. If the worst you can
> say is you can't see any advantages, then I think the non-obvious ones
> above make it well worth it ;-) Otherwise it would be great to hear
> constructive criticism and suggestions for improvement.
>
> Ali
> _______________________________________________
>

While your points #1 and #2 are true, I'm sure, that does not explain
why the RunRev team decided
their had to be a complete overhaul in what the thing looked like . . .

Richmond.

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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Richmond Mathewson-2
In reply to this post by Ali Lloyd-2
http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=25526

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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Rick Harrison
Hi Richmond,

I looked at the differences in these inspectors
and I came to the conclusion that the new
version is not an improvement.  What was
clear and everyone was used to in the old
version with the words has now been replaced
with smaller icons in the new version.

While I’m sure we will adjust eventually to
the new version, more silly icons isn’t what
we need.  The human brain has to do the
translation. I’m sure a text tool tip will magically
appear to tell us what the icon means after
a short delay, (I hope), but it won’t speed
along productivity for anyone.

Just my 2 cents.  ;-)

Rick

> On Oct 8, 2015, at 7:31 AM, Richmond <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=25526
>


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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Trevor DeVore
On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 11:16 AM, Rick Harrison <[hidden email]>
wrote:

>
> I looked at the differences in these inspectors
> and I came to the conclusion that the new
> version is not an improvement.  What was
> clear and everyone was used to in the old
> version with the words has now been replaced
> with smaller icons in the new version.
>
> While I’m sure we will adjust eventually to
> the new version, more silly icons isn’t what
> we need.  The human brain has to do the
> translation. I’m sure a text tool tip will magically
> appear to tell us what the icon means after
> a short delay, (I hope), but it won’t speed
> along productivity for anyone.
>

Rick,

I've actually found the new interface to be much more productive. I always
found that using an option menu to switch property inspector panes was
tedious as it required multiple clicks. Switching around between panes in
the inspector is much quicker now.

--
Trevor DeVore
ScreenSteps
www.screensteps.com    -    www.clarify-it.com
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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Ali Lloyd-2
One thing we can easily do is have a preference which allows you to switch
to the section names instead of icons.

On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 4:36 PM Trevor DeVore <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 11:16 AM, Rick Harrison <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> >
> > I looked at the differences in these inspectors
> > and I came to the conclusion that the new
> > version is not an improvement.  What was
> > clear and everyone was used to in the old
> > version with the words has now been replaced
> > with smaller icons in the new version.
> >
> > While I’m sure we will adjust eventually to
> > the new version, more silly icons isn’t what
> > we need.  The human brain has to do the
> > translation. I’m sure a text tool tip will magically
> > appear to tell us what the icon means after
> > a short delay, (I hope), but it won’t speed
> > along productivity for anyone.
> >
>
> Rick,
>
> I've actually found the new interface to be much more productive. I always
> found that using an option menu to switch property inspector panes was
> tedious as it required multiple clicks. Switching around between panes in
> the inspector is much quicker now.
>
> --
> Trevor DeVore
> ScreenSteps
> www.screensteps.com    -    www.clarify-it.com
> _______________________________________________
> use-livecode mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
> subscription preferences:
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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

J. Landman Gay
In reply to this post by Trevor DeVore
On 10/8/2015 10:36 AM, Trevor DeVore wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 11:16 AM, Rick Harrison <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
>>
>> I looked at the differences in these inspectors
>> and I came to the conclusion that the new
>> version is not an improvement.  What was
>> clear and everyone was used to in the old
>> version with the words has now been replaced
>> with smaller icons in the new version.
>>
>> While I’m sure we will adjust eventually to
>> the new version, more silly icons isn’t what
>> we need.  The human brain has to do the
>> translation. I’m sure a text tool tip will magically
>> appear to tell us what the icon means after
>> a short delay, (I hope), but it won’t speed
>> along productivity for anyone.
>>
>
> Rick,
>
> I've actually found the new interface to be much more productive. I always
> found that using an option menu to switch property inspector panes was
> tedious as it required multiple clicks. Switching around between panes in
> the inspector is much quicker now.
>

I have to mostly agree with Trevor here. The very first property
inspector had tabs for navigating panes and it was much faster and
easier to use. But as new panes were added there was no longer enough
horizontal space so tabs were replaced by the option menu. This has
always been awkward to use and there were some complaints about it at
first. Icons allow us to return to the original quick navigation we used
to have, so I'm in favor of them -- provisionally.

But as Rick said, it's not always easy to identify icons. Tooltips are a
must until we learn what they are. But even better would be icons with
labels, like the IDE toolbar has.

--
Jacqueline Landman Gay         |     [hidden email]
HyperActive Software           |     http://www.hyperactivesw.com


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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

J. Landman Gay
In reply to this post by Ali Lloyd-2
On 10/8/2015 11:21 AM, Ali Lloyd wrote:
> One thing we can easily do is have a preference which allows you to switch
> to the section names instead of icons.

I'd be all for that, if labelled icons aren't possible.

--
Jacqueline Landman Gay         |     [hidden email]
HyperActive Software           |     http://www.hyperactivesw.com

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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

RogGuay
In reply to this post by J. Landman Gay

> On Oct 8, 2015, at 10:50 AM, J. Landman Gay <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> But as Rick said, it's not always easy to identify icons. Tooltips are a must until we learn what they are. But even better would be icons with labels, like the IDE toolbar has.


Sometimes, a word is worth a thousand pictures!

Roger
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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Ali Lloyd-2
Labelled icons are also possible - we could potentially have a preference
setting for one, the other, or both.

They do already have tooltips, btw.

On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 6:56 PM Roger Guay <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> > On Oct 8, 2015, at 10:50 AM, J. Landman Gay <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> >
> > But as Rick said, it's not always easy to identify icons. Tooltips are a
> must until we learn what they are. But even better would be icons with
> labels, like the IDE toolbar has.
>
>
> Sometimes, a word is worth a thousand pictures!
>
> Roger
> _______________________________________________
> use-livecode mailing list
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>
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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Richard Gaskin
Ali Lloyd wrote:

 > Labelled icons are also possible - we could potentially have a
 > preference setting for one, the other, or both.

Inspectors are very useful in consumer apps, where the range of
properties is often smaller and their scope less broad.

In development tools we often see a Property Sheet that shows all
properties, as opposed to the subset we've had available in all
Inspectors thus far.

Here's an implementation I've been using whenever I need things not
found in any Inspector:
<http://fourthworld.net/revnet/devolution/4W_Props.rev.gz>

The design is largely functional, but suboptimal.  Time permitting it
would group related properties together under collapsible headers.

And when you think about, even if the Inspector were to continue to
limit itself to a subset of object properties, once you start down the
road of horizontal labels the design screams for such an accordion
design anyway.

Using that according design within a scrollable Property Sheet allows
for most of what folks are looking for here:

- Ease of access
- Clear labels for related properties

...and adds something that I don't recall coming up here yet but would
sooner or later:

- Completeness, the ability to see all of an object's properties

The latter is not only very valuable for pros who know about properties
not commonly used enough to have merited inclusion in an Inspector, but
also for newcomers who can learn about the scope of properties in an
object in one place.

--
  Richard Gaskin
  Fourth World Systems
  Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
  ____________________________________________________________________
  [hidden email]                http://www.FourthWorld.com


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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Dr. Hawkins
In reply to this post by RogGuay
On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 10:56 AM, Roger Guay <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Sometimes, a word is worth a thousand pictures!
>

I have the text toolbar set, and don't waste screen space on icons.

OK, so I spend more time in a terminal than the finder; I'm more a unix guy
who's hooked on spotlight and Apple's laptops than a mac guy.



--
Dr. Richard E. Hawkins, Esq.
(702) 508-8462
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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Peter Haworth
In reply to this post by Richard Gaskin
Completeness is indeed important, especially to newcomers as you point out.
There are some strange omissions from the pre-8 PI, e.g. it doesn't have a
place to specify a behavior for an option menu which, when I first started
using LC, led me to believe option menus couldn't have behaviors for some
reason.  I see that's been corrected in v8.

However, once you're past the newcomer stage, showing every possible
property is probably something you don't want, which brings me to the issue
of layout flexibility, the ability to organize properties together in a way
that makes sense for each individual user.  I want the properties I use the
most to show on a single tab, visible when I open the PI for an object,
with other properties grouped together in other tabs that fit the way I
work, even excluding some which I never use.

In some cases, properties seem like they are in the wrong place to me.  For
example,  the textHeight and firstIndent properties belong in the Text
formatting tab, not the basic tab, particularly textHeight which is
automatically changed when you change the font size.

I'm not sure the team should be devoting time to things like that right now
or maybe ever, so I included the ability to do all of the above in
lcStackBrowser

Pete
lcSQL Software <http://www.lcsql.com>
Home of lcStackBrowser <http://www.lcsql.com/lcstackbrowser.html> and
SQLiteAdmin <http://www.lcsql.com/sqliteadmin.html>

On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 11:59 AM, Richard Gaskin <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Ali Lloyd wrote:
>
> > Labelled icons are also possible - we could potentially have a
> > preference setting for one, the other, or both.
>
> Inspectors are very useful in consumer apps, where the range of properties
> is often smaller and their scope less broad.
>
> In development tools we often see a Property Sheet that shows all
> properties, as opposed to the subset we've had available in all Inspectors
> thus far.
>
> Here's an implementation I've been using whenever I need things not found
> in any Inspector:
> <http://fourthworld.net/revnet/devolution/4W_Props.rev.gz>
>
> The design is largely functional, but suboptimal.  Time permitting it
> would group related properties together under collapsible headers.
>
> And when you think about, even if the Inspector were to continue to limit
> itself to a subset of object properties, once you start down the road of
> horizontal labels the design screams for such an accordion design anyway.
>
> Using that according design within a scrollable Property Sheet allows for
> most of what folks are looking for here:
>
> - Ease of access
> - Clear labels for related properties
>
> ...and adds something that I don't recall coming up here yet but would
> sooner or later:
>
> - Completeness, the ability to see all of an object's properties
>
> The latter is not only very valuable for pros who know about properties
> not commonly used enough to have merited inclusion in an Inspector, but
> also for newcomers who can learn about the scope of properties in an object
> in one place.
>
> --
>  Richard Gaskin
>  Fourth World Systems
>  Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
>  ____________________________________________________________________
>  [hidden email]                http://www.FourthWorld.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-livecode mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
> subscription preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>
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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Richard Gaskin
Peter Haworth wrote:

 > On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 11:59 AM, Richard Gaskin wrote:
 >> Here's an implementation I've been using whenever I need things
 >> not found in any Inspector:
 >> <http://fourthworld.net/revnet/devolution/4W_Props.rev.gz>
 >>
 >> The design is largely functional, but suboptimal. Time permitting it
 >> would group related properties together under collapsible headers.
 >
 > Completeness is indeed important, especially to newcomers as you
 > point out.
 > There are some strange omissions from the pre-8 PI, e.g. it doesn't
 > have a place to specify a behavior for an option menu which, when I
 > first started using LC, led me to believe option menus couldn't have
 > behaviors for some reason.  I see that's been corrected in v8.
 >
 > However, once you're past the newcomer stage, showing every possible
 > property is probably something you don't want, which brings me to
 > the issue of layout flexibility, the ability to organize properties
 > together in a way that makes sense for each individual user.

The collapsible headers I referred to is the enhancement a good Property
Sheet should have to allow users to find properties easily.

Logical groupings allow you to work with just color props, or
size/location props, etc. as needed, and likely only crazy people like
me would expand all of them at once in an alphabetic list like the one
I'd built to see them all at once.

Ken Ray and I discussed having one of the theoretical collapsible
headers being Favorites, so anyone who finds themselves using a certain
subset of props frequently can include them there while still keeping
the logical groupings it would ship with by default.

The real value of the Prop Sheet implementation I shared isn't that it's
complete in that way, but merely that all of its prop labels and values
use only one field to display them.  Super easy to build and maintain,
and efficient to work with.

--
  Richard Gaskin
  Fourth World Systems
  Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
  ____________________________________________________________________
  [hidden email]                http://www.FourthWorld.com


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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Peter Haworth
Favorites would be a great addition.

Pete
lcSQL Software <http://www.lcsql.com>
Home of lcStackBrowser <http://www.lcsql.com/lcstackbrowser.html> and
SQLiteAdmin <http://www.lcsql.com/sqliteadmin.html>

On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 2:20 PM, Richard Gaskin <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Peter Haworth wrote:
>
> > On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 11:59 AM, Richard Gaskin wrote:
> >> Here's an implementation I've been using whenever I need things
> >> not found in any Inspector:
> >> <http://fourthworld.net/revnet/devolution/4W_Props.rev.gz>
> >>
> >> The design is largely functional, but suboptimal. Time permitting it
> >> would group related properties together under collapsible headers.
> >
> > Completeness is indeed important, especially to newcomers as you
> > point out.
> > There are some strange omissions from the pre-8 PI, e.g. it doesn't
> > have a place to specify a behavior for an option menu which, when I
> > first started using LC, led me to believe option menus couldn't have
> > behaviors for some reason.  I see that's been corrected in v8.
> >
> > However, once you're past the newcomer stage, showing every possible
> > property is probably something you don't want, which brings me to
> > the issue of layout flexibility, the ability to organize properties
> > together in a way that makes sense for each individual user.
>
> The collapsible headers I referred to is the enhancement a good Property
> Sheet should have to allow users to find properties easily.
>
> Logical groupings allow you to work with just color props, or
> size/location props, etc. as needed, and likely only crazy people like me
> would expand all of them at once in an alphabetic list like the one I'd
> built to see them all at once.
>
> Ken Ray and I discussed having one of the theoretical collapsible headers
> being Favorites, so anyone who finds themselves using a certain subset of
> props frequently can include them there while still keeping the logical
> groupings it would ship with by default.
>
> The real value of the Prop Sheet implementation I shared isn't that it's
> complete in that way, but merely that all of its prop labels and values use
> only one field to display them.  Super easy to build and maintain, and
> efficient to work with.
>
>
> --
>  Richard Gaskin
>  Fourth World Systems
>  Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
>  ____________________________________________________________________
>  [hidden email]                http://www.FourthWorld.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-livecode mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
> subscription preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>
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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Mark Talluto
In reply to this post by Trevor DeVore

> On Oct 8, 2015, at 8:36 AM, Trevor DeVore <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I've actually found the new interface to be much more productive. I always
> found that using an option menu to switch property inspector panes was
> tedious as it required multiple clicks. Switching around between panes in
> the inspector is much quicker now.

I agree that the new interface with panes is a lot faster for me too. I like that the grow/shrink animation found in earlier versions of LC has been replaced with a super fast no transition model.

Best regards,

Mark Talluto
canelasoftware.com <http://canelasoftware.com/>
CassiaDB: The rapid development, free local storage database, made for LiveCode developers: livecloud.io <http://www.livecloud.io/>





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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Ali Lloyd-2
In reply to this post by Richard Gaskin
OK, the palette header actually doesn't currently have the option to
display both icons and labels, so I might rectify that tomorrow.

For now, here's a pull request adding the display preference between icons
and labels.
https://github.com/livecode/livecode-ide/pull/564

The way we have written the property inspector, it will be very easy to
specify where you want particular properties to appear. We intended to add
grouping/folding/customization of this type straight away, but I guess it's
probably better to get the basics working first.

On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 10:20 PM Richard Gaskin <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Peter Haworth wrote:
>
>  > On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 11:59 AM, Richard Gaskin wrote:
>  >> Here's an implementation I've been using whenever I need things
>  >> not found in any Inspector:
>  >> <http://fourthworld.net/revnet/devolution/4W_Props.rev.gz>
>  >>
>  >> The design is largely functional, but suboptimal. Time permitting it
>  >> would group related properties together under collapsible headers.
>  >
>  > Completeness is indeed important, especially to newcomers as you
>  > point out.
>  > There are some strange omissions from the pre-8 PI, e.g. it doesn't
>  > have a place to specify a behavior for an option menu which, when I
>  > first started using LC, led me to believe option menus couldn't have
>  > behaviors for some reason.  I see that's been corrected in v8.
>  >
>  > However, once you're past the newcomer stage, showing every possible
>  > property is probably something you don't want, which brings me to
>  > the issue of layout flexibility, the ability to organize properties
>  > together in a way that makes sense for each individual user.
>
> The collapsible headers I referred to is the enhancement a good Property
> Sheet should have to allow users to find properties easily.
>
> Logical groupings allow you to work with just color props, or
> size/location props, etc. as needed, and likely only crazy people like
> me would expand all of them at once in an alphabetic list like the one
> I'd built to see them all at once.
>
> Ken Ray and I discussed having one of the theoretical collapsible
> headers being Favorites, so anyone who finds themselves using a certain
> subset of props frequently can include them there while still keeping
> the logical groupings it would ship with by default.
>
> The real value of the Prop Sheet implementation I shared isn't that it's
> complete in that way, but merely that all of its prop labels and values
> use only one field to display them.  Super easy to build and maintain,
> and efficient to work with.
>
> --
>   Richard Gaskin
>   Fourth World Systems
>   Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
>   ____________________________________________________________________
>   [hidden email]                http://www.FourthWorld.com
>
>
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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

ScottR
In reply to this post by Richard Gaskin
Instead of a scrolling accordion list with grouped sets of properties,
allow me to get radical and suggest a fixed index list on the left or
along the top of the palette.  You'd get one-click access to any category,
and no need to expand/collapse panes.  With an accordion control, you'll
likely suffer the same issues found in the current Project Browser: to
much vertical scrolling required to get to what you want, and no constant
reference for all property categories since they can be scrolled out of
view.

I may be voicing dissent here, but as you say "Let 1000 flowers bloom." :-)

Regards,

Scott Rossi
Creative Director
Tactile Media, UX/UI Design




On 10/8/15, 2:20 PM, "use-livecode on behalf of Richard Gaskin"
<[hidden email] on behalf of
[hidden email]> wrote:

>Peter Haworth wrote:
>
> > On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 11:59 AM, Richard Gaskin wrote:
> >> Here's an implementation I've been using whenever I need things
> >> not found in any Inspector:
> >> <http://fourthworld.net/revnet/devolution/4W_Props.rev.gz>
> >>
> >> The design is largely functional, but suboptimal. Time permitting it
> >> would group related properties together under collapsible headers.
> >
> > Completeness is indeed important, especially to newcomers as you
> > point out.
> > There are some strange omissions from the pre-8 PI, e.g. it doesn't
> > have a place to specify a behavior for an option menu which, when I
> > first started using LC, led me to believe option menus couldn't have
> > behaviors for some reason.  I see that's been corrected in v8.
> >
> > However, once you're past the newcomer stage, showing every possible
> > property is probably something you don't want, which brings me to
> > the issue of layout flexibility, the ability to organize properties
> > together in a way that makes sense for each individual user.
>
>The collapsible headers I referred to is the enhancement a good Property
>Sheet should have to allow users to find properties easily.
>
>Logical groupings allow you to work with just color props, or
>size/location props, etc. as needed, and likely only crazy people like
>me would expand all of them at once in an alphabetic list like the one
>I'd built to see them all at once.
>
>Ken Ray and I discussed having one of the theoretical collapsible
>headers being Favorites, so anyone who finds themselves using a certain
>subset of props frequently can include them there while still keeping
>the logical groupings it would ship with by default.
>
>The real value of the Prop Sheet implementation I shared isn't that it's
>complete in that way, but merely that all of its prop labels and values
>use only one field to display them.  Super easy to build and maintain,
>and efficient to work with.
>
>--
>  Richard Gaskin
>  Fourth World Systems
>  Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
>  ____________________________________________________________________
>  [hidden email]                http://www.FourthWorld.com
>
>
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>use-livecode mailing list
>[hidden email]
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>subscription preferences:
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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Richard Gaskin
Scott Rossi wrote:

> Instead of a scrolling accordion list with grouped sets of properties,
> allow me to get radical and suggest a fixed index list on the left or
> along the top of the palette.  You'd get one-click access to any category,
> and no need to expand/collapse panes.  With an accordion control, you'll
> likely suffer the same issues found in the current Project Browser: to
> much vertical scrolling required to get to what you want, and no constant
> reference for all property categories since they can be scrolled out of
> view.
>
> I may be voicing dissent here, but as you say "Let 1000 flowers bloom." :-)

At the risk of sounding boring, I think we're talking about the same thing.

If we took the existing Inspector and replaced the icons at the top with
horizontal labels we'd have something like (where "*this*" indicated
hilited item):

----------------
| Colors       |
----------------
|*Size*        |
----------------
| Behavior     |
----------------
| Other        |
----------------
| Favorites    |
----------------
|  List of     |
|  name-value  |
|  properties  |
|  for item    |
|  hilited     |
|  above       |
|  goes        |
|  here        |
----------------


An accordion style would keep all the labels visible, simply putting the
scrolling list field of name-value property pairs immediately below the
selection, taking the same amount of room but just making the header
more readily associated with the list it delivers:

----------------
| Colors       |
----------------
|*Size*        |
----------------
| List of      |
| name-value   |
| properties   |
| for item     |
| hilited      |
| above        |
| goes         |
| here         |
----------------
| Behavior     |
----------------
| Other        |
----------------
| Favorites    |
----------------



--
  Richard Gaskin
  Fourth World Systems
  Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
  ____________________________________________________________________
  [hidden email]                http://www.FourthWorld.com

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Re: LC 8 Property Inspector

Paul_Hibbert
In reply to this post by Ali Lloyd-2
On 8 Oct 2015, at 14:47, Ali Lloyd <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> OK, the palette header actually doesn't currently have the option to
> display both icons and labels, so I might rectify that tomorrow.

Ali,

If you are delving into the PI prefs tomorrow you may want to look at the bug report I’ve just submitted, http://quality.runrev.com/show_bug.cgi?id=16176 <http://quality.runrev.com/show_bug.cgi?id=16176> (Property Inspector not respecting Preference setting).

Hopefully this should be an one to easy fix.

Regards,

Paul

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