Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

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Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
Thanks Todd and Digital Pomegranate for the release of your first widget pack.
These and the others you have planned are essential for LiveCode and its growing user-base.
I just bought the widget pack. These are going to be very useful.

https://livecode.com/products/thirdparty/livecode-factory/mobile-native-essentials-widget-pack-1-0-0/ <https://livecode.com/products/thirdparty/livecode-factory/mobile-native-essentials-widget-pack-1-0-0/>

Best regards,

Mark Talluto
livecloud.io <http://livecloud.io/>
nursenotes.net <http://nursenotes.net/>
canelasoftware.com <http://www.canelasoftware.com/>




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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
I agree these look great, and because I know Digital Pomegranate I can
have lots of faith in them - so I will buy them (whenever I next want to
do a mobile project).

But - I have one (or maybe two) "objections"

1. I don't think items should go on sale on the store with *no*
documentation available for what they are, what they do, how they are
used, customization/preferences available, .... - nothing but the names
of the widgets.

2. it would be really nice if there were also a desktop version of each
of these. I *want* to be able to create a project that works on all
platforms (and, in particular, on the ones that allow for the
super-quick development cycle we get for desktop).

I guess this is a comment for any widget that anyone is going to produce ...

-- Alex.

P.S. Hmmm - I see the same objection applies to all (or most) of the
other items on the third-party store - but I still think the objection
is valid :-)


On 11/04/2018 17:27, Mark Talluto via use-livecode wrote:

> Thanks Todd and Digital Pomegranate for the release of your first widget pack.
> These and the others you have planned are essential for LiveCode and its growing user-base.
> I just bought the widget pack. These are going to be very useful.
>
> https://livecode.com/products/thirdparty/livecode-factory/mobile-native-essentials-widget-pack-1-0-0/ <https://livecode.com/products/thirdparty/livecode-factory/mobile-native-essentials-widget-pack-1-0-0/>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Mark Talluto
> livecloud.io <http://livecloud.io/>
> nursenotes.net <http://nursenotes.net/>
> canelasoftware.com <http://www.canelasoftware.com/>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-livecode mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences:
> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode


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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
On 04/11/2018 09:57 AM, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode wrote:
> But - I have one (or maybe two) "objections"

One other quibble:
I'm normally reluctant to put down good money on something with a major
version of zero. And with no visible upgrade policy or licensing.

--
  Mark Wieder
  [hidden email]


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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
There's no such thing as "good money". ;-) But I agree, it feels like I am paying for beta software, which always makes me nervous.

Bob S


> On Apr 11, 2018, at 10:58 , Mark Wieder via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> One other quibble:
> I'm normally reluctant to put down good money on something with a major version of zero. And with no visible upgrade policy or licensing.
>
> --
> Mark Wieder
> [hidden email]


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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
$49 for the amount of work that went into making these widgets is quite affordable. Yes, these are listed as v .5. They could have labeled them as v 1.0. That leaves everyone the opportunity to find things that need to be fixed or improved and provide feedback. These key features are not coming any other way than this. LiveCode does not have the resources to build these themselves. Here is our chance to get them now and not years down the road.

Look at this another way. Surely the income generated from the apps we make, if we are doing commercial work, will cover the cost of these essential controls.  If you are not making software for money, getting these might be questionable. But, I know of people that will burn that value on coffee each week. At least these widgets will help you make money and/or save time.

This is a no brainer for those making mobile apps. I do have a wish list. The main one is to have a working desktop representation of the controls. For some of them it is not much extra work. For others, there probably is no native equivalent to mimic on the desktop. This is certainly not the fault of Digital Pomegranate.

Best regards,

Mark Talluto
livecloud.io <http://livecloud.io/>
nursenotes.net <http://nursenotes.net/>
canelasoftware.com <http://www.canelasoftware.com/>


> On Apr 11, 2018, at 11:06 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> There's no such thing as "good money". ;-) But I agree, it feels like I am paying for beta software, which always makes me nervous.
>
> Bob S
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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
On 04/11/2018 03:01 PM, Mark Talluto via use-livecode wrote:
> $49 for the amount of work that went into making these widgets is quite affordable. Yes, these are listed as v .5. They could have labeled them as v 1.0. That leaves everyone the opportunity to find things that need to be fixed or improved and provide feedback. These key features are not coming any other way than this. LiveCode does not have the resources to build these themselves. Here is our chance to get them now and not years down the road.

Just to be clear about this, I'm not at all concerned about the price.
As far as I can tell this is a very useful set of controls at an
entirely reasonable price.

But that's me reading between the lines since there's not a lot of
description at the store, and it's hard to know things like:

* if there are special licensing requirements if you put these in a
commercial app - are they dual-licensed?

* whether these controls work with any LC version or just the higher-end
versions

* what you get when you purchase the pack - I see Digital Pomegranate
has other extensions in the store. Are these part of this package? Some
of them? All of them?

and really, the 0.5.0 version makes it look like "you can buy into this
now and be part of the beta program. We're about halfway there now."

--
  Mark Wieder
  [hidden email]

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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
In reply to this post by Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
On 04/11/2018 11:06 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode wrote:
> There's no such thing as "good money". ;-)

Good money is the money I used to have. <g>

--
  Mark Wieder
  [hidden email]

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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
In reply to this post by Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
On 11/04/2018 23:01, Mark Talluto via use-livecode wrote:

> $49 for the amount of work that went into making these widgets is quite affordable. Yes, these are listed as v .5. They could have labeled them as v 1.0.
Well, actually, they did :-)

Since I know I'm going to buy them anyway, I went ahead and did it now -
partly to see if that gives me more info about licensing, updates,
documentations, etc.

In my purchase-receipt email from Livecode, it says:
> Thank you for purchasing the Mobile Native Essentials Widgets Pack!
> This includes the Activity Indicator, Switch, Date Picker, Time
> Picker, Progress, Slider, Label and Search Bar. You will receive all
> updates to this product and its components free of charge until it is
> out of beta.
which sounds like it really is still in Beta.

But then if I go to https://livecode.com/account/products/thirdparty I
discover that I have v1.0.0 available to download - or I can pay a
further $58 to upgrade to v0.5.0 !?

So I clicked on the download button, and got a zip/folder called
"WidgetPackBeta"
Now I have a bunch of ".lce" files, one per widget, plus a
WidgetPackInstaller.livecode

Running that gives me a dialog asking "install all" - click that gives
me an error

stack "Widget Pack Installer": execution error at line 33 (Handler:
can't find handler) near "revIDEExtensionInstall", char 1

so I guess I need to go read about installing widget extensions ...

-- Alex.

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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
On 04/11/2018 04:56 PM, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode wrote:
> so I guess I need to go read about installing widget extensions ...

LOL. The tl;dr is

an .lce file is a zip archive. Rename it to .zip and open it the usual
way. Extract the .lcb file from the archive, open it with the Extension
Builder from the IDE Tools menu (using the little folder icon in the
upper right). Then click the Install icon from the bunch at the lower left.

I'm somewhat sure there must be an easier way.

--
  Mark Wieder
  [hidden email]

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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 7:47 PM, Mark Wieder via use-livecode <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 04/11/2018 04:56 PM, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode wrote:
>
>> so I guess I need to go read about installing widget extensions ...
>>
>
> LOL. The tl;dr is
>
> an .lce file is a zip archive. Rename it to .zip and open it the usual
> way. Extract the .lcb file from the archive, open it with the Extension
> Builder from the IDE Tools menu (using the little folder icon in the upper
> right). Then click the Install icon from the bunch at the lower left.
>
> I'm somewhat sure there must be an easier way.


Use the Extension Manager which is accessed from the Tools menu. There is
 "+" button. Click it and select the .lce file.

FWIW the installer stack that came with the download installed everything
successfully for me in LC 9. On the plus side there are docs for the
widgets in the Dictionary. Unfortunately when I try to test the search
widget in the iOS simulator the widget doesn't render. It just says
"SearchText (unlicensed)".

--
Trevor DeVore
ScreenSteps
www.screensteps.com
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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
On 04/11/2018 07:10 PM, Trevor DeVore via use-livecode wrote:
> Use the Extension Manager which is accessed from the Tools menu. There is
>   "+" button. Click it and select the .lce file.

Oh, sure, if you want to skip the fun of going the long way around.
I bet you also probably stop looking for your keys once you find them.

--
  Mark Wieder
  [hidden email]

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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
In reply to this post by Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 9:10 PM, Trevor DeVore <[hidden email]>
wrote:

>
>  Unfortunately when I try to test the search widget in the iOS simulator
> the widget doesn't render. It just says "SearchText (unlicensed)".
>

I used the Help menu to Re-license LiveCode and now the widgets are
licensed.

--
Trevor DeVore
ScreenSteps
www.screensteps.com
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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
In reply to this post by Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 9:55 PM Mark Wieder via use-livecode <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 04/11/2018 07:10 PM, Trevor DeVore via use-livecode wrote:
> > Use the Extension Manager which is accessed from the Tools menu. There is
> >   "+" button. Click it and select the .lce file.
>
> Oh, sure, if you want to skip the fun of going the long way around.
> I bet you also probably stop looking for your keys once you find them.


I may never know. The last time I saw them they slid out of my pocket,
tumbled down a rock face, and fell 40 feet into the river.


Trevor DeVore

>
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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
In reply to this post by Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
It not the money, certainly worth it…
but it’s that for every widget I have to create a

if isMobile() then
    # use the widget
else
    # development is being on desktop.
    # then what?
End if

Maybe I am missing something?

Even if developing from mobile on desktop …
we need a reasonable representation to take this widgets place on desktop.
A seamless environment.

BR


Alex Tweedly wrote:

    2. it would be really nice if there were also a desktop version of each
    of these. I *want* to be able to create a project that works on all
    platforms (and, in particular, on the ones that allow for the
    super-quick development cycle we get for desktop).

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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
In reply to this post by Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
Alex: that installation error suggests you are trying to install in too early a version of LiveCode. The widget pack requires 9.0 dp 11 or later.

I'll investigate the store "update" issue, sounds like a glitch.

Regards,

Heather


Heather Laine
Customer Services Manager
LiveCode Ltd
www.livecode.com



> On 12 Apr 2018, at 00:56, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> On 11/04/2018 23:01, Mark Talluto via use-livecode wrote:
>
>> $49 for the amount of work that went into making these widgets is quite affordable. Yes, these are listed as v .5. They could have labeled them as v 1.0.
> Well, actually, they did :-)
>
> Since I know I'm going to buy them anyway, I went ahead and did it now - partly to see if that gives me more info about licensing, updates, documentations, etc.
>
> In my purchase-receipt email from Livecode, it says:
>> Thank you for purchasing the Mobile Native Essentials Widgets Pack! This includes the Activity Indicator, Switch, Date Picker, Time Picker, Progress, Slider, Label and Search Bar. You will receive all updates to this product and its components free of charge until it is out of beta.
> which sounds like it really is still in Beta.
>
> But then if I go to https://livecode.com/account/products/thirdparty I discover that I have v1.0.0 available to download - or I can pay a further $58 to upgrade to v0.5.0 !?
>
> So I clicked on the download button, and got a zip/folder called "WidgetPackBeta"
> Now I have a bunch of ".lce" files, one per widget, plus a WidgetPackInstaller.livecode
>
> Running that gives me a dialog asking "install all" - click that gives me an error
>
> stack "Widget Pack Installer": execution error at line 33 (Handler: can't find handler) near "revIDEExtensionInstall", char 1
>
> so I guess I need to go read about installing widget extensions ...
>
> -- Alex.
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-livecode mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences:
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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
Thank you Heather - that's exactly the problem, I was on 9.0.0 DP9

I installed 9.0.0 stable, and widgets installed just fine.

Thanks again,

Alex.


On 12/04/2018 09:49, Heather Laine via use-livecode wrote:

> Alex: that installation error suggests you are trying to install in too early a version of LiveCode. The widget pack requires 9.0 dp 11 or later.
>
> I'll investigate the store "update" issue, sounds like a glitch.
>
> Regards,
>
> Heather
>
>
> Heather Laine
> Customer Services Manager
> LiveCode Ltd
> www.livecode.com
>
>
>
>> On 12 Apr 2018, at 00:56, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> On 11/04/2018 23:01, Mark Talluto via use-livecode wrote:
>>
>>> $49 for the amount of work that went into making these widgets is quite affordable. Yes, these are listed as v .5. They could have labeled them as v 1.0.
>> Well, actually, they did :-)
>>
>> Since I know I'm going to buy them anyway, I went ahead and did it now - partly to see if that gives me more info about licensing, updates, documentations, etc.
>>
>> In my purchase-receipt email from Livecode, it says:
>>> Thank you for purchasing the Mobile Native Essentials Widgets Pack! This includes the Activity Indicator, Switch, Date Picker, Time Picker, Progress, Slider, Label and Search Bar. You will receive all updates to this product and its components free of charge until it is out of beta.
>> which sounds like it really is still in Beta.
>>
>> But then if I go to https://livecode.com/account/products/thirdparty I discover that I have v1.0.0 available to download - or I can pay a further $58 to upgrade to v0.5.0 !?
>>
>> So I clicked on the download button, and got a zip/folder called "WidgetPackBeta"
>> Now I have a bunch of ".lce" files, one per widget, plus a WidgetPackInstaller.livecode
>>
>> Running that gives me a dialog asking "install all" - click that gives me an error
>>
>> stack "Widget Pack Installer": execution error at line 33 (Handler: can't find handler) near "revIDEExtensionInstall", char 1
>>
>> so I guess I need to go read about installing widget extensions ...
>>
>> -- Alex.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> use-livecode mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences:
>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>
> _______________________________________________
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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
In reply to this post by Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
The marketing of these widgets and the other 3rd party extensions could use a little work. The descriptions for those that I clicked on where sparse and lacking screenshots. Licensing should be better addressed as well. Clicking on any of the widgets in the aforementioned pack makes it look like each widget is $49. But, if you continue a bit further, you can see that they lead back to the bunch being sold for $49. Confusing…yes.  
 
I found installing them to be painless because I was using LC 9 gm at the time. The installer should do a quick check on the LC version and provide helpful information. A sample stack containing all the widgets would have been a nice touch. LC requirements should be listed for all extensions in the store. Basically, the concerns listed by us all apply to every extension I reviewed. FWIW, lcTaskList does have a screenshot. Some of the extensions in the store come with readme files, instructions, and licensing details. Maybe some or all of these details need to be more public facing. Should improve sales for everyone involved.  

This is generally referred to as the productization of a tool. It is equally time consuming and sometimes more painful than the creation of the tool itself. Based on all the feedback so far, it is clear that it is important. I am sure there was excitement by both Digital Pomegranate and LiveCode to make these widgets available to us.

Best regards,

Mark Talluto
livecloud.io <http://livecloud.io/>
nursenotes.net <http://nursenotes.net/>
canelasoftware.com <http://www.canelasoftware.com/>


> On Apr 11, 2018, at 4:56 PM, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> But then if I go to https://livecode.com/account/products/thirdparty <https://livecode.com/account/products/thirdparty> I discover that I have v1.0.0 available to download - or I can pay a further $58 to upgrade to v0.5.0 !?
>
> So I clicked on the download button, and got a zip/folder called "WidgetPackBeta"
> Now I have a bunch of ".lce" files, one per widget, plus a WidgetPackInstaller.livecode
>
> Running that gives me a dialog asking "install all" - click that gives me an error
>
> stack "Widget Pack Installer": execution error at line 33 (Handler: can't find handler) near "revIDEExtensionInstall", char 1
>
> so I guess I need to go read about installing widget extensions ...


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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
In reply to this post by Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
These are early days for widgets with seamless integration for all platforms. It is coming. Complex things like this take time to complete. Hang in there.

Best regards,

Mark Talluto
livecloud.io <http://livecloud.io/>
nursenotes.net <http://nursenotes.net/>
canelasoftware.com <http://www.canelasoftware.com/>


> On Apr 11, 2018, at 8:19 PM, Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> It not the money, certainly worth it…
> but it’s that for every widget I have to create a
>
> if isMobile() then
>    # use the widget
> else
>    # development is being on desktop.
>    # then what?
> End if
>
> Maybe I am missing something?
>
> Even if developing from mobile on desktop …
> we need a reasonable representation to take this widgets place on desktop.
> A seamless environment.

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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
In reply to this post by Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
🤪

> On Apr 11, 2018, at 19:54 , Mark Wieder via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> On 04/11/2018 07:10 PM, Trevor DeVore via use-livecode wrote:
>> Use the Extension Manager which is accessed from the Tools menu. There is
>>  "+" button. Click it and select the .lce file.
>
> Oh, sure, if you want to skip the fun of going the long way around.
> I bet you also probably stop looking for your keys once you find them.
>
> --
> Mark Wieder
> [hidden email]

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Re: Mobile Native Essentials Widget Pack

Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
In reply to this post by Bob Sneidar via use-livecode
> On Apr 11, 2018, at 20:05 , Trevor DeVore via use-livecode <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> On 04/11/2018 07:10 PM, Trevor DeVore via use-livecode wrote:
>>> Use the Extension Manager which is accessed from the Tools menu. There is
>>>  "+" button. Click it and select the .lce file.
>>
>> Oh, sure, if you want to skip the fun of going the long way around.
>> I bet you also probably stop looking for your keys once you find them.
>
>
> I may never know. The last time I saw them they slid out of my pocket,
> tumbled down a rock face, and fell 40 feet into the river.
>
> —
> Trevor DeVore

So you walked back home uphill all the way? Yeah, we heard that story already. ;-)

Bob S



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