copy file on Mac

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copy file on Mac

Chipp Walters
I have a user who tells me that copying files in MacOSX with the URL
command creates a target file which no longer launches Excel when
double-clicked on:

put URL ("binfile:" & "text.xls") into URL ("binfile:" & "text2.xls")

IOW, text2.xls when double-clicked on won't launch Excel, even though
text.xls will.

Any ideas? (I'm not near a Mac OSX right now. )

TIA,
Chipp

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Re: copy file on Mac

J. Landman Gay
Chipp Walters wrote:

> I have a user who tells me that copying files in MacOSX with the URL
> command creates a target file which no longer launches Excel when
> double-clicked on:
>
> put URL ("binfile:" & "text.xls") into URL ("binfile:" & "text2.xls")
>
> IOW, text2.xls when double-clicked on won't launch Excel, even though
> text.xls will.
>
> Any ideas? (I'm not near a Mac OSX right now. )

You probably need to set the filetype property before creating the file.
OS X most likely thinks the file is a text file (in spite of the
extension) because Rev's default filetype is TextEdit. If I used Excel I
might even be able to tell you what the filetype should be, but I bet
someone else can.

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Re: copy file on Mac

masmit
In reply to this post by Chipp Walters
You probably just need to set the fileType before you write the file  
- I don't know what the file type of excel is, but it shouldn't be  
hard to find out.

Best,

Mark

On 9 May 2006, at 00:40, Chipp Walters wrote:

> I have a user who tells me that copying files in MacOSX with the  
> URL command creates a target file which no longer launches Excel  
> when double-clicked on:
>
> put URL ("binfile:" & "text.xls") into URL ("binfile:" & "text2.xls")
>
> IOW, text2.xls when double-clicked on won't launch Excel, even  
> though text.xls will.
>
> Any ideas? (I'm not near a Mac OSX right now. )
>
> TIA,
> Chipp
>
> --
> --------------
> Chipp Walters
> www.altuit.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> [hidden email]
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Re: copy file on Mac

xtalkprogrammer
In reply to this post by Chipp Walters
Hi Chipp,

Check the file and creator type of the original file and make sure to  
the filetype before using the put url command.

Best,

Mark

--

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Op 9-mei-2006, om 1:40 heeft Chipp Walters het volgende geschreven:

> I have a user who tells me that copying files in MacOSX with the  
> URL command creates a target file which no longer launches Excel  
> when double-clicked on:
>
> put URL ("binfile:" & "text.xls") into URL ("binfile:" & "text2.xls")
>
> IOW, text2.xls when double-clicked on won't launch Excel, even  
> though text.xls will.
>
> Any ideas? (I'm not near a Mac OSX right now. )
>
> TIA,
> Chipp
>
> --
> --------------
> Chipp Walters
> www.altuit.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> use-revolution mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your  
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>

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Kind regards,

Drs. Mark Schonewille

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Re: copy file on Mac

Ken Ray
On 5/8/06 6:49 PM, "Mark Schonewille" <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Hi Chipp,
>
> Check the file and creator type of the original file and make sure to
> the filetype before using the put url command.

And FYI, for Office 2004 for Mac, the creator is "XCEL" and the type is
"XLS8" (case sensitive).

If for some reason the .xls file has resources in it, you might also want to
do a "resfile:" copy as well, as in:

set the fileType to "XCELXLS8"
put URL ("binfile:" & "text.xls") into URL ("binfile:" & "text2.xls")
put URL ("resfile:" & "text.xls") into URL ("resfile:" & "text2.xls")

HTH,


Ken Ray
Sons of Thunder Software
Web site: http://www.sonsothunder.com/
Email: [hidden email]

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Re: copy file on Mac

Chipp Walters
Thanks to everyone who replied.

Let me get this right. You all are saying Macs _CAN'T LAUNCH A FILE
BASED UPON EXTENSION_ ?

I understood why this was in MacOS9, but you would think that would've
changed by now...it is 2006 and the OS is supposedly modern. Surely
there is a setting somewhere which manages all this? After all, we do
live in a world with more than one OS.

Or, do I need to create a lookup table and reset filetypes for each and
every file downloaded? How do all of you do this?

Thanks again for your comments!

-Chipp

Ken Ray wrote:

> On 5/8/06 6:49 PM, "Mark Schonewille" <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
>
>>Hi Chipp,
>>
>>Check the file and creator type of the original file and make sure to
>>the filetype before using the put url command.
>
>
> And FYI, for Office 2004 for Mac, the creator is "XCEL" and the type is
> "XLS8" (case sensitive).
>
> If for some reason the .xls file has resources in it, you might also want to
> do a "resfile:" copy as well, as in:
>
> set the fileType to "XCELXLS8"
> put URL ("binfile:" & "text.xls") into URL ("binfile:" & "text2.xls")
> put URL ("resfile:" & "text.xls") into URL ("resfile:" & "text2.xls")

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Re: copy file on Mac

Brian Yennie
Chipp,

No- MacOSX has no problem launching files based upon extension. I
believe the problem is that your can override that behavior by
explicitly setting a file type. Since Revolution defaults to setting
this to TEXT, you have to manage it yourself to avoid getting screwy
files.

I would hope that you could at least clear the setting in Revolution,
or it does indeed make it very difficult to produce double-clickable
files from Rev. I can't say that I've tried...

HTH,
Brian

> Thanks to everyone who replied.
>
> Let me get this right. You all are saying Macs _CAN'T LAUNCH A FILE
> BASED UPON EXTENSION_ ?
>
> I understood why this was in MacOS9, but you would think that would've
> changed by now...it is 2006 and the OS is supposedly modern. Surely
> there is a setting somewhere which manages all this? After all, we do
> live in a world with more than one OS.
>
> Or, do I need to create a lookup table and reset filetypes for each
> and every file downloaded? How do all of you do this?
>
> Thanks again for your comments!
>
> -Chipp
>
> Ken Ray wrote:
>> On 5/8/06 6:49 PM, "Mark Schonewille"
>> <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>> Hi Chipp,
>>>
>>> Check the file and creator type of the original file and make sure to
>>> the filetype before using the put url command.
>> And FYI, for Office 2004 for Mac, the creator is "XCEL" and the type
>> is
>> "XLS8" (case sensitive).
>> If for some reason the .xls file has resources in it, you might also
>> want to
>> do a "resfile:" copy as well, as in:
>> set the fileType to "XCELXLS8"
>> put URL ("binfile:" & "text.xls") into URL ("binfile:" & "text2.xls")
>> put URL ("resfile:" & "text.xls") into URL ("resfile:" & "text2.xls")
>
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> use-revolution mailing list
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> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
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>
>

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Re: copy file on Mac

Richard Gaskin
In reply to this post by Chipp Walters
Mark Schonewille wrote:
> Check the file and creator type of the original file and make sure to  
> the filetype before using the put url command.

While that will certainly take care of this specific problem, it isn't
the real solution.   For example, what if the user downloads an XLS from
the web or FTP?

Applications identify their file extensions in their info.plist files.
Sounds like the Finder's just being flaky.

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Re: copy file on Mac

Chipp Walters
In reply to this post by Chipp Walters
Richard Gaskin mentioned you can *force* a file launch *sometimes* ;-)
by using the get info for a filetype, choosing which application and
then pressing the "Change All.." button.

I tried this on a single file, and it did seem to work. I'm hoping Apple
will come to it's senses soon and fix this eratic and un-standard behavior.

<rant>
Our development of altBrowser and other externals on the Mac takes more
than 10X the resources (our time) for the PC. It's not a familiarity
thing, but rather the fact that Apple keeps changing the frig&&ng spec,
every dot release. They actually change libraries during dot releases
for things like WebKit!! Not to mention, nothing's ever tested, and
there are few decent resources to get good dev help (other than paying
thousands to Apple as a certified Mac Developer). Now, they've broken
the WebKit printing engine, and we're having to jump through hoops to
work with the new one, undocumented and apparently very buggy.

Not to mention, they release a whole new version of the OS every year or
so. Geez.
</rant>

-Chipp

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Re: copy file on Mac

Sarah Reichelt-2
In reply to this post by Brian Yennie
> No- MacOSX has no problem launching files based upon extension. I
> believe the problem is that your can override that behavior by
> explicitly setting a file type. Since Revolution defaults to setting
> this to TEXT, you have to manage it yourself to avoid getting screwy
> files.
>
> I would hope that you could at least clear the setting in Revolution,
> or it does indeed make it very difficult to produce double-clickable
> files from Rev. I can't say that I've tried...

I do this all the time. If you set the fileType to empty before saving
a file, the extension is used to select the default app fpr that file.
That way you never have to worry about what app the user has selected
as the default for any particular file type.

Cheers,
Sarah
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Re: copy file on Mac

Richard Gaskin
In reply to this post by Chipp Walters
Chipp Walters wrote:

> Richard Gaskin mentioned you can *force* a file launch *sometimes* ;-)
> by using the get info for a filetype, choosing which application and
> then pressing the "Change All.." button.
>
> I tried this on a single file, and it did seem to work. I'm hoping Apple
> will come to it's senses soon and fix this eratic and un-standard behavior.

But my tip only reliably addresses files with no type, such as
downloaded files.  When we spoke I had forgotten that RR sets the file
type by default to "TEXT", so doing that Get Info trick on an .xls file
set to "TEXT" may produce unexpected results (does that affect files of
the same type or files with the same extension?  Or did the Mac team and
the NeXT team ever settle their little fight over that yet?)

As Sarah pointed out, it's more reliable to first set the file type to
empty before writing a file whose extension is known but whose Finder
type may not be. If you know the file type of course you can just set
that before writing.


> <rant>
> Our development of altBrowser and other externals on the Mac takes more
> than 10X the resources (our time) for the PC.
...
> Not to mention, they release a whole new version of the OS every year or
> so. Geez.
> </rant>

Hang on to your seat -- about the time developers begin to recover from
the devastating losses from the one-two-three punch in the face of
68k->PPC, Classic->OS X, and most recently PPC->Intel, Apple may
possibly replace the file system:

    Apple is reportedly interested in porting Sun's Solaris
    "ZFS" filesystem to Mac OS X, and is seeking community
    assistance -- the ZFS team at Sun is reportedly pleased
    and fully supports the effort being spearheaded by Chris
    Emura, Apple's Filesystem Development Manager.
    <http://www.macosrumors.com/>

Don't worry.  They wouldn't dream of putting all the hurdles out at one
time.  It creates much more artificial demand for otherwise-unnecessary
upgrades to space these transitions out.  Where would third parties be
in the Apple world if not for the last three artificial-demand cycles?

--
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  Managing Editor, revJournal
  _______________________________________________________
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Re: copy file on Mac

Chipp Walters
In reply to this post by Sarah Reichelt-2
Thanks Sarah! That may be just what I was looking for :-)

Sarah Reichelt wrote:

> I do this all the time. If you set the fileType to empty before saving
> a file, the extension is used to select the default app fpr that file.
> That way you never have to worry about what app the user has selected
> as the default for any particular file type.

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Re: copy file on Mac

J. Landman Gay
In reply to this post by Chipp Walters
Chipp Walters wrote:
> Richard Gaskin mentioned you can *force* a file launch *sometimes* ;-)
> by using the get info for a filetype, choosing which application and
> then pressing the "Change All.." button.
>
> I tried this on a single file, and it did seem to work. I'm hoping Apple
> will come to it's senses soon and fix this eratic and un-standard behavior.

It's much easier than that and I think Apple did get it right. As Brian
pointed out, Rev sets the filetype by default to text files. The Finder
accomodates both methods of checking which app to launch. However, if a
file has both a creator/type as well as an extension, it uses the
creator/type codes first.

Because Rev sets the file type to TEXT by default, the OS never gets
around to looking at the extension. You can force the issue in one of
two ways:

1. Override Rev's filetype setting. Set the filetype yourself. On Macs
this is preferable because some Macs will not have made associations yet
to your chosen extension, and on those Macs the OS will have to ask what
to do.

2. Set the filetype to "??????" which is the secret code for "unknown
file type". If the OS sees that, it will try to match the extension.

So, it's okay. ;)

--
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Re: copy file on Mac

J. Landman Gay
J. Landman Gay wrote:

I made a typo:

> 2. Set the filetype to "??????" which is the secret code for "unknown
> file type". If the OS sees that, it will try to match the extension.

All filetype have 8 characters. There should be 8 question marks there.
But as several people mentioned, an empty filetype works too.

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Re: copy file on Mac

Chipp Walters
Even Better!!!
Thanks :-)

best,
Chipp

J. Landman Gay wrote:

> J. Landman Gay wrote:
>
> I made a typo:
>
>> 2. Set the filetype to "??????" which is the secret code for "unknown
>> file type". If the OS sees that, it will try to match the extension.
>
>
> All filetype have 8 characters. There should be 8 question marks there.
> But as several people mentioned, an empty filetype works too.
>

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Re: copy file on Mac

xtalkprogrammer
In reply to this post by Chipp Walters
Sarah and Chipp,

Please! Don't set the filetype to empty. This can cause unexpected  
results, such as files appearing at random locations in Finder  
windows or even off-screen on the desktop, particularly on older  
systems. Have mercy with the users of your software. Instead, set the  
filetype to "????????".

Thanks,

Mark

--

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Consultancy and Software Engineering
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www.salery.biz/salery.html



Op 9-mei-2006, om 6:12 heeft Chipp Walters het volgende geschreven:

> Thanks Sarah! That may be just what I was looking for :-)
>
> Sarah Reichelt wrote:
>
>> I do this all the time. If you set the fileType to empty before  
>> saving
>> a file, the extension is used to select the default app fpr that  
>> file.
>> That way you never have to worry about what app the user has selected
>> as the default for any particular file type.


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Kind regards,

Drs. Mark Schonewille

Economy-x-Talk Consultancy and Software Engineering
Homepage: http://economy-x-talk.com
Twitter: http://twitter.com/xtalkprogrammer
Facebook: http://facebook.com/LiveCode.Beginner
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Re: copy file on Mac

Francis Nugent Dixon
In reply to this post by Chipp Walters
Hi Chipp,

After following the Creator/Type codes through all the
versions of Mac OS for many years, it's the sort of thing
you get used to. Apple invented the idea back in the dark
ages, and now they are stuck with it, as least until OS 9
and Classic die the death !
I wrote a HC stack many years ago to adjust Creator/Type
codes that had gone astray (for some reason), and I still
use it today. There are files floating around on the web
which give a complete list of all of these codes and their
mother applications. I have a list which is never far from
my side. I can reproduce at will,  examples of files with
perfectly good extensions, that when double-clicked with
the Hypercard application active, come up with the message
"Stack is invalid" (or something like that !). I have to close
Hypercard to be able to double-click the file !

You may be surprised to know that I have had several
instances where Revolution saved my stack under the
name "Stackname.rev", and a double-click wouldn't
open it . Just looking at the file icon tells you that
something is wrong. I launch Revolution and execute
"Open", and things go back to normal. Unfortunately,
it's not "reproducible" (although I think it is because
I have a wait in my closeStack handler, and I sometimes
quit revolution with cmd/Q when my stack is still open).

There are some things you just have to live with (Sigh !)

-Francis

"Nothing should ever be done for the first time !"


> From: Chipp Walters
>
> Let me get this right. You all are saying Macs _CAN'T LAUNCH A FILE
> BASED UPON EXTENSION_ ?
>


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Re: copy file on Mac

Richard Gaskin
In reply to this post by Chipp Walters
Mark Schonewille wrote:

> Sarah and Chipp,
>
> Please! Don't set the filetype to empty. This can cause unexpected  
> results, such as files appearing at random locations in Finder  
> windows or even off-screen on the desktop, particularly on older  
> systems. Have mercy with the users of your software. Instead, set the  
> filetype to "????????".

Is the Mac so brittle that merely copying a file from any file system
that doesn't support Mac metadata will cause these anomalies?

I've seen the Finder be a tad flaky now and then, but nothing quite as
extreme as moving files to inaccessible locations by simply not having a
creator code assigned to them.

--
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Re: copy file on Mac

Ian Wood-3

On 9 May 2006, at 14:43, Richard Gaskin wrote:

> Mark Schonewille wrote:
>
>> Sarah and Chipp,
>> Please! Don't set the filetype to empty. This can cause  
>> unexpected  results, such as files appearing at random locations  
>> in Finder  windows or even off-screen on the desktop, particularly  
>> on older  systems. Have mercy with the users of your software.  
>> Instead, set the  filetype to "????????".
>
> Is the Mac so brittle that merely copying a file from any file  
> system that doesn't support Mac metadata will cause these anomalies?
>
> I've seen the Finder be a tad flaky now and then, but nothing quite  
> as extreme as moving files to inaccessible locations by simply not  
> having a creator code assigned to them.

Can't say I've ever seen this with empty filetypes, but I tend to be  
working with recent versions of the OS. Sounds more like an  
installation-specific problem.

Certainly, copying files from FAT16 or FAT32 disks has never resulted  
in files disappearing...

Ian
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Re: copy file on Mac

xtalkprogrammer
In reply to this post by Richard Gaskin
Hi Richard,

If you still have a Mac running Mac OS 9, why don't you just give it  
a try? Create a file without file and creator type and put that into  
a folder. Stuff or zip that folder and decompress it on the Mac OS 9  
machine. Play with it for a while, open and close the files, move the  
folder elsewhere, or add and remove files to or from the folder. On  
my Classic machine, it usually takes less than a minute for the files  
to jump to another location in the window.

This has little to do with Revolution, though. Usually, good network  
software and a properly installed File Exchange control panel take  
care of this, but not always, as is the case with compressed files.  
Setting the file type to "????????" makes sure that zipped and  
stuffed files contain the correct meta data and doesn't take much  
more effort than setting the file type to empty.

Best,

Mark

--

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http://www.salery.biz

Salery is the easiest way to get your own web store on-line: http://
www.salery.biz/salery.html



Op 9-mei-2006, om 15:43 heeft Richard Gaskin het volgende geschreven:

> Mark Schonewille wrote:
>
>> Sarah and Chipp,
>> Please! Don't set the filetype to empty. This can cause  
>> unexpected  results, such as files appearing at random locations  
>> in Finder  windows or even off-screen on the desktop, particularly  
>> on older  systems. Have mercy with the users of your software.  
>> Instead, set the  filetype to "????????".
>
> Is the Mac so brittle that merely copying a file from any file  
> system that doesn't support Mac metadata will cause these anomalies?
>
> I've seen the Finder be a tad flaky now and then, but nothing quite  
> as extreme as moving files to inaccessible locations by simply not  
> having a creator code assigned to them.

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