remove DEFAULTMENUBAR?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi friends,

we can:
...
set the defaultmenubar to "name of any group"
...

But when I try to remove the menubar again with
...
set the defaultmenubar to EMPTY
...
I get an error: Cannot find group (or something)

However I can set the defaultmenubar of a specific stack to EMPTY!?
...
set the defaultmenubar of this stack to EMPTY
...

So how can we remove a defaultmenubar NOT tied to a stack?
What am I missing?


Best

Klaus
--
Klaus Major
https://www.major-k.de
[hidden email]


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[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi Klaus. 

I never have worked at all with this group, and was surprised that it was a LC stack in the first place. 

So I do not know why one cannot set it to empty, except maybe that something inside LC prevents that. 

On a completely tangential note, my defaultMenubar contains ten buttons, the first one being button "File", and the last one (after button "help") being button "divider". No idea where that button is, or what it does. 

Craig


-----Original Message-----
From: Klaus major-k via use-livecode <[hidden email]>
To: LiveCode Runrev.Com <[hidden email]>
Cc: Klaus major-k <[hidden email]>
Sent: Fri, Nov 22, 2019 8:34 am
Subject: remove DEFAULTMENUBAR?

Hi friends,

we can:
...
set the defaultmenubar to "name of any group"
...

But when I try to remove the menubar again with
...
set the defaultmenubar to EMPTY
...
I get an error: Cannot find group (or something)

However I can set the defaultmenubar of a specific stack to EMPTY!?
...
set the defaultmenubar of this stack to EMPTY
...

So how can we remove a defaultmenubar NOT tied to a stack?
What am I missing?


Best

Klaus
--
Klaus Major
https://www.major-k.de
[hidden email]


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[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi Craig,

> Am 22.11.2019 um 14:54 schrieb dunbarx--- via use-livecode <[hidden email]>:
>
> Hi Klaus.
>
> I never have worked at all with this group, and was surprised that it was a LC stack in the first place.

no, a menubar is a group of buttons, not a stack.
It CAN be a stack however, but not if you want an Apple macOS menubar.

> So I do not know why one cannot set it to empty, except maybe that something inside LC prevents that.

Anyway, thank you for your moral support! :-)

I had to force-quit LC, after saving everything via the message box, then I switched to:
...
set the defaultmenubar of this stack to "my menu group here"
...
Then I can:
...
set the defaultmenubar of this stack to EMPTY
...

> On a completely tangential note, my defaultMenubar contains ten buttons, the first one being button "File", and the last one (after button "help") being button "divider". No idea where that button is, or what it does.

It divides, right? 8-)

> Craig

Best

Klaus

--
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https://www.major-k.de
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[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi all,

> Am 22.11.2019 um 14:33 schrieb Klaus major-k via use-livecode <[hidden email]>:
>
> Hi friends,
>
> we can:
> ...
> set the defaultmenubar to "name of any group"
> ...
>
> But when I try to remove the menubar again with
> ...
> set the defaultmenubar to EMPTY
> ...
> I get an error: Cannot find group (or something)
>
> However I can set the defaultmenubar of a specific stack to EMPTY!?
> ...
> set the defaultmenubar of this stack to EMPTY
> ...
>
> So how can we remove a defaultmenubar NOT tied to a stack?
> What am I missing?

noone? Really? :-/


Best

Klaus

--
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https://www.major-k.de
[hidden email]


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[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

The defaultmenubar is a GROUP.
Empty is not a group. So you could try:

create a new group
set the defaultmenubar to that empty group
delete that empty group

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[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hallo Hermann,

> Am 28.11.2019 um 15:42 schrieb hh via use-livecode <[hidden email]>:
>
> The defaultmenubar is a GROUP.
> Empty is not a group.

so is "the menubar of stack xyz", but we can:
...
set the menubar of this stack to EMPTY
...
Why does that not work for the "defaultmenubar", empty is also no group here!?

> So you could try:
>
> create a new group
> set the defaultmenubar to that empty group
> delete that empty group

hm, I was hoping for a ONE-Liner, that can easily be executed via script.
Anyway, thank you!


Best

Klaus

--
Klaus Major
https://www.major-k.de
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[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

As I understand this:

the menubar of this stack is a container (containing a group reference),
the defaultmenubar is itself a (may be referenced) group.


> Klaus M. wrote:
> hm, I was hoping for a ONE-Liner, that can easily be executed via script.

You could use semicolons ;-)

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[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi Hermann,

> Am 28.11.2019 um 16:07 schrieb hh via use-livecode <[hidden email]>:
>
> As I understand this:
>
> the menubar of this stack is a container (containing a group reference),
> the defaultmenubar is itself a (may be referenced) group.

OK, but there MUST be a way to remove that defaultmenubar!
Having to force-quit LC for this is definitively a no-go!

Panos, Mark, or someone else from the mothership?

>> Klaus M. wrote:
>> hm, I was hoping for a ONE-Liner, that can easily be executed via script.
>
> You could use semicolons ;-)

LOL! OK, convinced. :-D


Best

Klaus
--
Klaus Major
https://www.major-k.de
[hidden email]


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[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I pondered this myself some years ago, and was unable to find a way to
clear the default menubar.

Perhaps setting it to a group you then delete might do it, but that
seems wonkier than we would expect for a tool like LC.

So we might instead ask: why doesn't the engine offer a means of easily
clearing the default menubar?

Or to put it another way:  What benefit is there to the end-user to do
that, to have an incomplete menubar whenever a stack is brought forward
that has no menu group?

It's kinda nice that macOS will provide at least some basic menu items
when no menubar is established by the app, but I've never shipped an app
where that sparse set could be satisfying to my users.

If it's enough for your app, perhaps an enhancement request may be in order.

--
  Richard Gaskin
  Fourth World Systems
  Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
  ____________________________________________________________________
  [hidden email]                http://www.FourthWorld.com

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[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi Richard,

> Am 28.11.2019 um 17:20 schrieb Richard Gaskin via use-livecode <[hidden email]>:
>
> I pondered this myself some years ago, and was unable to find a way to clear the default menubar.

ah, OK, thank you, I thought I had missed something.

> Perhaps setting it to a group you then delete might do it, but that seems wonkier than we would expect for a tool like LC.
> So we might instead ask: why doesn't the engine offer a means of easily clearing the default menubar?
> Or to put it another way:  What benefit is there to the end-user to do that, to have an incomplete menubar whenever a stack is brought forward that has no menu group?
>
> It's kinda nice that macOS will provide at least some basic menu items when no menubar is established by the app, but I've never shipped an app where that sparse set could be satisfying to my users.
>
> If it's enough for your app, perhaps an enhancement request may be in order.

Yes, will do now!

> --
> Richard Gaskin

Best

Klaus

--
Klaus Major
https://www.major-k.de
[hidden email]


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[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Hi all,

> Am 28.11.2019 um 17:27 schrieb Klaus major-k via use-livecode <[hidden email]>:
> Hi Richard,
>> Am 28.11.2019 um 17:20 schrieb Richard Gaskin via use-livecode <[hidden email]>:
>> I pondered this myself some years ago, and was unable to find a way to clear the default menubar.
>
> ah, OK, thank you, I thought I had missed something.
>> Perhaps setting it to a group you then delete might do it, but that seems wonkier than we would expect for a tool like LC.
>> So we might instead ask: why doesn't the engine offer a means of easily clearing the default menubar?
>> Or to put it another way:  What benefit is there to the end-user to do that, to have an incomplete menubar whenever a stack is brought forward that has no menu group?
>> It's kinda nice that macOS will provide at least some basic menu items when no menubar is established by the app, but I've never shipped an app where that sparse set could be satisfying to my users.
>> If it's enough for your app, perhaps an enhancement request may be in order.
> Yes, will do now!

Done: <https://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=22471>


Best

Klaus
--
Klaus Major
https://www.major-k.de
[hidden email]


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